> "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> later years in life.

> But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> You’re just getting by.

> The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> Internal Revenue Service.

> As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html

> the article:
> Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> and
> Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> felony offense.

> On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > later years in life.

> > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > You’re just getting by.

> > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > Internal Revenue Service.

> > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html

> I see deflation occurring at this time..
> it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > the article:
> > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > and
> > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > felony offense.

> > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > later years in life.

> > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > You’re just getting by.

> > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html- Hide quoted text -

> - Show quoted text -

> "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> later years in life.

> But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> You’re just getting by.

> The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> Internal Revenue Service.

> As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html

> Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> "commodity pendulum".

> More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> is responsible.

> After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> debasement."

> On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > the article:
> > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > and
> > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > felony offense.

> > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > later years in life.

> > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hide quoted text -

> > - Show quoted text -

> There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> the head!:

> "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> a
> parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > "commodity pendulum".

> > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > is responsible.

> > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > debasement."

> > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > the article:
> > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > and
> > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > felony offense.

> > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hidequoted text -

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> - Show quoted text -

> There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> the head!:

> "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> a
> parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > "commodity pendulum".

> > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > is responsible.

> > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > debasement."

> > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > the article:
> > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > and
> > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > felony offense.

> > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hidequoted text -

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> - Show quoted text -

> Pathetic.

> People should look to the federal government for very little.
> Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> was founded upon.

> On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > the head!:

> > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > a
> > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > is responsible.

> > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > debasement."

> > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > the article:
> > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > and
> > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hidequotedtext -

> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> > - Show quoted text -

> I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

>To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> government must implement policy changes to address
> the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> policy changes include steps to:
> 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> minimum wage
> 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> individuals
> • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> to benefit more families
> • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> • Support policies that strengthen families
> • Create more affordable housing
> • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> • Improve access to education and training
> • Address the growing wealth disparity
> To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> progressive tax policies that will benefit
> lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> pay more.

> On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Pathetic.

> > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > was founded upon.

> > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > the head!:

> > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > a
> > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > is responsible.

> > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > debasement."

> > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hidequotedtext-

> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> - Show quoted text -

> These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> represent massive interference in the free market society we
> historically thrived in.

> People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> specified in the agenda you listed.

> As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > government must implement policy changes to address
> > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > policy changes include steps to:
> > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > minimum wage
> > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > individuals
> > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > to benefit more families
> > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > • Create more affordable housing
> > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > • Improve access to education and training
> > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > pay more.

> > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > Pathetic.

> > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > was founded upon.

> > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > the head!:

> > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > a
> > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > debasement."

> > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble bursts, as it has in the
> > > > > > > > home-mortgage market. The irony is that the statists, Republicans and
> > > > > > > > Democrats alike, blame inevitably blame the crises on “free
> > > > > > > > enterprise” and call for socialist measures to solve the problem, as
> > > > > > > > they have in the current mortgage crisis."

> > > > > > > > Full article here:http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article15353.html-Hidequotedtext-

> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> > - Show quoted text -

> Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > historically thrived in.

> > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > minimum wage
> > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > individuals
> > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > to benefit more families
> > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > pay more.

> > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > Pathetic.

> > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > was founded upon.

> > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > the head!:

> > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > a
> > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> > > > > > > > > Along comes election time, which is an important time for incumbent
> > > > > > > > > public officials. To assist them, the Fed engages in intricate
> > > > > > > > > operations that artificially lower the interest rate, thereby sending
> > > > > > > > > a false signal into the market. Businessmen rely on that signal,
> > > > > > > > > borrow the money, and expand their operations. A couple of years
> > > > > > > > > later, things shake out. The so-called bubble

> Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> supporter).

> The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> wealth.

> On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > historically thrived in.

> > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > minimum wage
> > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > individuals
> > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > to benefit more families
> > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > pay more.

> > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.
> > > > > > > > > > You’re just getting by.

> > > > > > > > > > The reason for this is the Federal Reserve, in conjunction with the
> > > > > > > > > > Internal Revenue Service.

> > > > > > > > > > As libertarians, we understand the importance of capital to prosperity
> > > > > > > > > > and a rising standard of living. When people save, they place their
> > > > > > > > > > savings in the bank. That increase in the supply of available capital
> > > > > > > > > > causes interest rates to drop, sending a signal to businesses that
> > > > > > > > > > additional capital is available in the marketplace. Businesses borrow
> > > > > > > > > > the money to purchase tools and equipment that make their workers more
> > > > > > > > > > productive. More productivity increases the revenue of the firm,
> > > > > > > > > > thereby making more money available to pay higher wages.

> Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> country.

> On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > supporter).

> > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > wealth.

> > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > individuals
> > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > pay more.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or for your
> > > > > > > > > > > later years in life.

> > > > > > > > > > > But if you’re like most Americans today, you’re having a difficult
> > > > > > > > > > > time making ends meet. Moreover, not only are you not saving a large
> > > > > > > > > > > portion of your income, you’re likely not saving anything at all.

> I live in the DC-Baltimore region. Going into areas of either great
> city makes me sad and angry.  I know why these areas are the way they
> are, and I want to tell everyone I see.  But I cannot.  My concepts of
> freedom, opportunity and prosperity are dismissed and derided.  The
> false promise of entitlement has a stranglehold around countless necks
> of Americans everywhere.  Sadly, it must collapse into the thin air
> from where it came before the masses will be forcefully awakened to
> the injustice they have endured and perpetuated.

> On Nov 28, 1:44 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> > society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> > country.

> > On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > > supporter).

> > > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > > wealth.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > > individuals
> > > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > > pay more.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay

> I have things I would like to say about that as well, but Im sure it's
> not what anyone wants to hear.

> On Nov 28, 1:59 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > I live in the DC-Baltimore region. Going into areas of either great
> > city makes me sad and angry.  I know why these areas are the way they
> > are, and I want to tell everyone I see.  But I cannot.  My concepts of
> > freedom, opportunity and prosperity are dismissed and derided.  The
> > false promise of entitlement has a stranglehold around countless necks
> > of Americans everywhere.  Sadly, it must collapse into the thin air
> > from where it came before the masses will be forcefully awakened to
> > the injustice they have endured and perpetuated.

> > On Nov 28, 1:44 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> > > society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> > > country.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > > > supporter).

> > > > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > > > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > > > wealth.

> > > > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > > > individuals
> > > > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > > > pay more.

> > > > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> I live in the DC-Baltimore region. Going into areas of either great
> city makes me sad and angry.  I know why these areas are the way they
> are, and I want to tell everyone I see.  But I cannot.  My concepts of
> freedom, opportunity and prosperity are dismissed and derided.  The
> false promise of entitlement has a stranglehold around countless necks
> of Americans everywhere.  Sadly, it must collapse into the thin air
> from where it came before the masses will be forcefully awakened to
> the injustice they have endured and perpetuated.

> On Nov 28, 1:44 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> > society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> > country.

> > On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > > supporter).

> > > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > > wealth.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > > individuals
> > > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > > pay more.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > "I would assume that most of you are not independently wealthy. You
> > > > > > > > > > > > work for a living. You bring home a paycheck. You try to make ends
> > > > > > > > > > > > meet. You try to save a portion of your income, perhaps to help pay
> > > > > > > > > > > > for your children’s education, to provide for a rainy day, or

> hiya cassandra

> On Nov 28, 12:59 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > I live in the DC-Baltimore region. Going into areas of either great
> > city makes me sad and angry.  I know why these areas are the way they
> > are, and I want to tell everyone I see.  But I cannot.  My concepts of
> > freedom, opportunity and prosperity are dismissed and derided.  The
> > false promise of entitlement has a stranglehold around countless necks
> > of Americans everywhere.  Sadly, it must collapse into the thin air
> > from where it came before the masses will be forcefully awakened to
> > the injustice they have endured and perpetuated.

> > On Nov 28, 1:44 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> > > society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> > > country.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > > > supporter).

> > > > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > > > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > > > wealth.

> > > > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > > > individuals
> > > > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > > > pay more.

> > > > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin had been
> > > > > > > > > > > > doing in communist Russia. Indeed, even the chancellor of Germany in
> > > > > > > > > > > > the 1930s sent Roosevelt a letter commending him on his economic
> > > > > > > > > > > > programs, stating that he were doing the same thing in Germany.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Roosevelt and his cronies also convinced people that part of the
> > > > > > > > > > > > problem was the fact that the American people were using gold coins
> > > > > > > > > > > > and silver coins as their money. Nothing could be more ludicrous.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Nonetheless, Roosevelt used the economic emergency to commit one of
> > > > > > > > > > > > the most heinous crimes in U.S. history. He ordered every American to
> > > > > > > > > > > > turn in his gold to the federal government, at a devalued price. What
> > > > > > > > > > > > had been the money standard for more a century now became a federal
> > > > > > > > > > > > felony offense.

> > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Speak thy mind, meester squeege.

> On Nov 28, 3:47 pm, squeege <squeeg...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > I have things I would like to say about that as well, but Im sure it's
> > not what anyone wants to hear.

> > On Nov 28, 1:59 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > I live in the DC-Baltimore region. Going into areas of either great
> > > city makes me sad and angry.  I know why these areas are the way they
> > > are, and I want to tell everyone I see.  But I cannot.  My concepts of
> > > freedom, opportunity and prosperity are dismissed and derided.  The
> > > false promise of entitlement has a stranglehold around countless necks
> > > of Americans everywhere.  Sadly, it must collapse into the thin air
> > > from where it came before the masses will be forcefully awakened to
> > > the injustice they have endured and perpetuated.

> > > On Nov 28, 1:44 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > Agreed.  The "economic justice" agenda is a corrupting influence on
> > > > society.  No where is this more apparent than in the ghettos of this
> > > > country.

> > > > On Nov 28, 1:38 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > Well, that explains my brother (converted Catholic and devoted Obama
> > > > > supporter).

> > > > > The government should not be funding any of these organizations.  It
> > > > > achieves this funding by devaluing, confiscating and redistributing
> > > > > wealth.

> > > > > On Nov 28, 1:27 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > Actually, it's the agenda of Catholic Charities.  I copied it from
> > > > > > their website.  People may have become complacent and ignorant, but
> > > > > > this is the social gospel the mainstream ecclesiastic authorities have
> > > > > > been espousing for sometime now.  ACORN, a past beneficiary of
> > > > > > charitable contributions by Catholics, is just one of many
> > > > > > organizations the Federal Government funds that promote this agenda.

> > > > > > On Nov 28, 1:13 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > These initiatives sound great on paper (and in speeches, which makes
> > > > > > > it easy for statist politicians to win elections), but actually
> > > > > > > represent massive interference in the free market society we
> > > > > > > historically thrived in.

> > > > > > > People have become complacent and increasingly ignorant, particularly
> > > > > > > over the last two generations, to the point where nearly the majority
> > > > > > > of people expect the government to provide and create the conditions
> > > > > > > specified in the agenda you listed.

> > > > > > > As the original article discloses, it is the unique ability to borrow
> > > > > > > and monetize deficit spending through the central bank (Fed) which has
> > > > > > > enabled statist politicians of both major parties to "promise the
> > > > > > > world" when in reality they are stealing from us all by devaluing our
> > > > > > > labor and confiscating/redistributing our wealth.

> > > > > > > A return to sound money will mean a return to a sound America.

> > > > > > > On Nov 28, 12:08 pm, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > I solicited comments on another thread regarding an agenda from a
> > > > > > > > prominent group that I believe is very influential in this way of
> > > > > > > > thinking-that the government is our provider.  Here it is again:

> > > > > > > >To combat poverty systematically and effectively, the federal
> > > > > > > > government must implement policy changes to address
> > > > > > > > the current weaknesses in our economic and social policies. These
> > > > > > > > policy changes include steps to:
> > > > > > > > 1) Create more livable wage jobs and raise wages, including the
> > > > > > > > minimum wage
> > > > > > > > 2) Invest in social policies that support low-income families and
> > > > > > > > individuals
> > > > > > > > • Strengthen and protect our nation’s nutrition safety net
> > > > > > > > • Improve the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program
> > > > > > > > to benefit more families
> > > > > > > > • Ensure universal health insurance coverage
> > > > > > > > • Improve access to safe and stable child care
> > > > > > > > • Support policies that strengthen families
> > > > > > > > • Create more affordable housing
> > > > > > > > • Improve the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) to be more inclusive
> > > > > > > > • Improve access to education and training
> > > > > > > > • Address the growing wealth disparity
> > > > > > > > To assist in paying for these policy changes,XXXXX supports
> > > > > > > > progressive tax policies that will benefit
> > > > > > > > lower and middle income taxpayers while asking those who have more to
> > > > > > > > pay more.

> > > > > > > > On Nov 28, 10:48 am, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Pathetic.

> > > > > > > > > People should look to the federal government for very little.
> > > > > > > > > Security and justice through the law.  We should barely know the
> > > > > > > > > federal government is even there, let alone regard it as a friend,
> > > > > > > > > parent or a god. This is preposterous and against all that our nation
> > > > > > > > > was founded upon.

> > > > > > > > > On Nov 28, 8:52 am, squeegeny <squeeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > There's the crux of the problem.  I believe you hit the nail right on
> > > > > > > > > > the head!:

> > > > > > > > > > "After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend,
> > > > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say."

> > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:53 pm, Viking <grizzlybea...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > Increases in the money supply (classic definition of inflation)
> > > > > > > > > > > typically result in delayed increases in the prices of commodities,
> > > > > > > > > > > which we are seeing in the form of higher energy and food prices, as
> > > > > > > > > > > well as gold and silver. Howard Katz refers to this phenomenon as the
> > > > > > > > > > > "commodity pendulum".

> > > > > > > > > > > More from the article (one of the best I've read lately):

> > > > > > > > > > > "As prices in society begin rising in response to the devaluing
> > > > > > > > > > > dollar, the average person doesn’t have any idea that the government
> > > > > > > > > > > is behind it, which is precisely why government officials love a
> > > > > > > > > > > central bank so much. They know full well that the average person is
> > > > > > > > > > > going to lay the blame for rising prices on such things as greed,
> > > > > > > > > > > capitalism, free enterprise, and profit. Seeing prices rise, he’ll
> > > > > > > > > > > blame the oil companies, the service station owners, the grocers, and
> > > > > > > > > > > clothing stores. The last thing he’ll consider is that it is the
> > > > > > > > > > > federal government itself, operating through the Federal Reserve, that
> > > > > > > > > > > is responsible.

> > > > > > > > > > > After all, most people look upon the federal government as a friend, a
> > > > > > > > > > > parent, even a god. Our government is our provider, they say. It
> > > > > > > > > > > provides our retirement, food, unemployment compensation, health care,
> > > > > > > > > > > education, and so forth. It also protects us from the terrorists, the
> > > > > > > > > > > communists, the drug dealers, the illegal aliens, and other scary
> > > > > > > > > > > creatures. It would never do anything bad to us, much less seize our
> > > > > > > > > > > income and earnings secretly and surreptitiously through monetary
> > > > > > > > > > > debasement."

> > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 9:41 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > I see deflation occurring at this time..
> > > > > > > > > > > > it's like a fire sale, prices are low.

> > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 27, 8:39 pm, suzireb <suzi...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the article:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Several years ago, Ben Bernanke, before he became chairman of the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve, was speaking at a dinner in honor of Friedman. In
> > > > > > > > > > > > > what has turned out to be one of the most remarkable admissions by a
> > > > > > > > > > > > > public official, Bernanke openly and publicly admitted that it was the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Federal Reserve that caused the Great Depression.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Franklin Roosevelt seized on that government-caused crisis to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > revolutionize America’s economic system, foisting on our land a
> > > > > > > > > > > > > panoply of socialist and fascist programs, in the name of “saving free
> > > > > > > > > > > > > enterprise.” In fact, Roosevelt’s programs mirrored what the Benito
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mussolini was doing in fascist Italy and what Joseph Stalin